Our Future Plans - Q&A with Debbie & Phil

Special Meeting Intro

00:00:00:21 - 00:00:16:07 - Debbie

Hello there everyone. I hope you're keeping safe and well, I'm Debbie Robinson, the CEO at Central Co-op. And here we are this evening at the support centre in Warwick for Midcounties. Phil, tell us what's been going on.

00:00:16:09 - 00:00:41:10 - Phil

Well, as you say, Debbie, we're here this evening. It's Monday evening. We've just finished our special members meeting, which is the first formal meeting, that Midcounties has held. To put the proposed merger to our members. We had over 700 members join us either online or here in person at Warwick. And I'm pleased to say that those members voted with a 96.61% majority in favour of the proposed merger.

00:00:41:10 - 00:01:01:15 - Phil

And of course, we needed two thirds of members to vote in favour. So that's more than carried by those members. So a great evening. There was some fantastic questions, and good answers given by the President of Midcounties, Irene Kirkman, the Vice Presidents, Vivian Woodell and also Paul Mather. We were on the platform and of course, Debbie were answering questions as well.

00:01:01:17 - 00:01:30:02 - Debbie

Absolutely. What a fantastic turnout and the most amazing result that really does give us the platform to move forward. So I just want to remind all members of Central Co-op whether your colleagues, colleague members, to join us on Wednesday, the 19th of November at the Derby County Cricket ground, which of course is sponsored by Central Co-op, to have your say and make sure that this vote goes through.

00:01:30:04 - 00:01:50:08 - Phil

And of course, if that vote is carried on Wednesday evening by your members, as it has been this evening, because you only need a simple majority at your meeting, we will then be having the confirmatory meeting for Midcounties members, which will be on the 2nd of December. So that's on 2nd December, where we will just need a simple majority vote just to confirm the resolution.

00:01:50:08 - 00:01:54:24 - Phil

And then after that, we'll be working very hard to progress the merger to its completion.

00:01:55:01 - 00:02:23:07 - Debbie

Fantastic. So our integration plans will really start in earnest, but we just want to go back to our regular podcast, and we want to remind all of you to keep the questions coming. Getting through the democratic process is one thing, but the detail of integration is another, and we really want to make sure that we understand from you exactly what it is you want the most out of this proposed merger of two fantastic independent co-operative societies.

00:02:23:13 - 00:02:38:18 - Phil

Yeah, it's quite late now on a Monday evening, and I want to get away and get my tie off because I don't often wear a tie anymore. But it's been nice to wear one this evening, and of course, don't forget, we pre-recorded a podcast last week from your brilliant Lichfield funeral home. So we're going to show you that now, if that's okay.

 

 

Q&A

00:00:14:08 - 00:00:21:04 - Debbie

Hello there everyone. I hope that you're keeping safe and well. I'm Debbie Robinson, the Chief Executive at Central Co-op.

00:00:21:06 - 00:00:24:16 - Phil

And I'm Phil Ponsonby, the Chief Executive at Midcounties Co-op.

00:00:24:18 - 00:00:42:05 - Debbie

Welcome back to our joint podcast series. We're here in Lichfield at our wonderful funeral home. This home was actually part of the Midcounties Estate until recently when we brought those two fantastic businesses together.

00:00:42:07 - 00:01:02:00 - Phil

Yes, it's great what you've done with this place. Well, because I remember when it was part of Midcounties, it's had a wonderful refurbishment and, and before we talk about this home here, in Lichfield or your funeral services. More generally, as I mentioned on the podcast that went out last week. You've recently been in Doha at the Second World Social Summit.

00:01:02:02 - 00:01:24:07 - Debbie

Absolutely. Phil. I was actually asked to speak at the UN and the closure of the International Year of Co-operatives. So what a great honour that was. So we were there with heads of state, members of the UN and of course many co-operators. So what we did is we combined the CM50, which is the top 50 co-ops and mutuals in the world.

00:01:24:09 - 00:01:51:15 - Debbie

You and I we attended a session, in Madrid earlier on in the year. So our output from the UN's International Year of Co-operatives has been the creation of the CM50. So I was able to talk about the important role that co-ops play in the future of society as a whole, how we can really help the UN deliver against their social goals.

00:01:51:17 - 00:02:26:22 - Debbie

And most importantly, we talked about the creation of a global platform that would allow co-op to co-op trade. This really is an ethical Amazon and how important that would be. And certainly in my research for the presentation, I learned so much. So firstly, the turnover of the top 300 co-operatives in the world is actually £2.74 trillion. That is four times bigger than Amazon and that is without digitalisation.

00:02:27:01 - 00:02:45:14 - Debbie

So can you just imagine if you bring the 200 year old idea of co-operative and apply digital technology to that, just how quickly we could grow if we were a country with that sort of turnover would be the seventh, eighth biggest in the world.

00:02:45:20 - 00:03:11:08 - Phil

It's incredible statistics, isn't it? And I know from my involvement in the CM50 obviously I didn't get to go to Doha, but some, you know, the range of businesses that are represented as part that CM50 from agriculture to health to retailers as ours is, this there's such a variety of businesses. So the idea of bringing all of those co-operatives together through a digital platform so they can trade more openly and more in a more efficient way with each other, is a brilliant idea.

00:03:11:10 - 00:03:12:11 - Phil

Good luck with that.

00:03:12:13 - 00:03:34:03 - Debbie

Well, it really is. I mean, it's fairly audacious, I have to say, but we today are talking about our societies coming together to create a wonderful, co-operative society for the future. But even with the scale that we're going to have, we're not going to be in a position to even consider building a platform that would allow trade across the whole of the globe.

00:03:34:05 - 00:03:57:04 - Debbie

So it's only by working with co-operators from across the world that we're actually going to be able to fulfill this. And as you say, just imagine how big and significant that would be. Imagine when you landed, you were traveling and it usually pops up and it tells you which network to join, but it would be able to tell you that your nearest co-op is just down the road.

00:03:57:05 - 00:04:12:15 - Debbie

It would be really transformational. I just think it's what we need to modernise the movement. The movement has always had a history of courage, of being pioneering, but actually we've been really slow in terms of the digitalisation across the movement.

00:04:12:15 - 00:04:19:01 - Phil

So brilliant that our new enlarged society, will be playing a big part in that. And that's really good news isn’t it.

00:04:19:01 - 00:04:24:04 - Debbie

Absolutely. Well, it's bringing all of our voices together that's really allowing this to happen.

00:04:24:07 - 00:04:48:12 - Phil

Well done. Yes. It's worth, recalling also that the time we spent in Madrid was with the CM50 to come up with the ideas, and I think there were three ideas on the day. You had a great idea. I had an idea, along with others as well, and we sort of shaped those ideas, but I think yours was undoubtably the sort of the really innovative, thought provoking idea around tech platforms.

00:04:48:12 - 00:04:53:11 - Phil

So how did it land with others at the World Social Summit?

00:04:53:13 - 00:05:14:22 - Debbie

Well, as you can imagine, it was a fairly nerve wracking experience in the first instance. But I have to say, I couldn't believe the positive response that we actually received. And as a consequence, I was asked to join a panel and actually speak again throughout the event. So that was really good because great questions make you think really deeply about it.

00:05:14:22 - 00:05:42:04 - Debbie

But there's a lot of interest, particularly from India and also from the United States. And what was staggering is across the CM50 is there is no business to business between those co-ops. So everyone is excited at the opportunity. So the next stage in the process is to look at how we can finance this. And as you know, there are 3 million co-ops across the world.

00:05:42:06 - 00:05:54:24 - Debbie

There are over a billion members. So very quickly, we could mobilise with even micro donations to start funding seed funding the idea and see where we get to.

00:05:55:01 - 00:06:06:23 - Phil

So I sort of people's Amazon potentially, you know, people own this thing because they're owning the co-ops and the co-ops create it. And now it's a very different model, than exists today. So very exciting.

00:06:07:00 - 00:06:31:01 - Debbie

Absolutely. And my children are always saying to me, it is so needed. I think people trade on Amazon because of its convenience, but the fact that we would be able to have a digital global platform, co-op to co-op trade, that would give all the assurance and ethics that are so strongly associated with the co-operative movement would just be brilliant.

00:06:31:02 - 00:06:46:15 - Phil

Well, I guess also it would be easier for new co-ops to be created as well, because if you've got this platform where co-ops can trade, then it's an easier route to market. If you're going to create a co-operative, so it encourages the growth of co-operatives across the world as well, which is a really important part of it.

00:06:46:17 - 00:07:11:13 - Debbie

It really is. There's actually a small co-op fairly close to here in Leicester that is just Fairtrade, and that is actually their name, Just Fairtrade. So we're working closely with them and we are going to look at opportunities perhaps of introducing their ranges into some of the larger stores, especially when the two societies come together, because we'll have a really strong cohort that I think will be really attractive to our members.

00:07:11:16 - 00:07:16:20 - Debbie

And actually I think will be instrumental in converting customers into members for the future.

00:07:17:00 - 00:07:46:02 - Phil

That's brilliant. And, I know we're here today in, you're wonderful. Lichfield Funeral operation which, you know, back up until 2021 was a part of The Midcounties Co-operative, as we said earlier. And, back in 2021, we transferred our Funeral business over to yourselves a year after you transferred your Travel business over to us. As part of that agreement to focus on, you know, what we felt we could really put, investment and effort into.

00:07:46:02 - 00:07:58:14 - Phil

And I can see the, transformation here, at Lichfield. So, you know, brilliant job. And, you know, it was definitely the right decision. So can you tell us a bit more about the the Funeral services that you're operating today?

00:07:58:16 - 00:08:30:16 - Debbie

Thanks. Phil. And I have to say, the most important aspect of our funeral services is actually is the people. They are truly extraordinary. And I I've said this many times, and I will say again, I have never asked anybody to do something that I wouldn't be prepared to do myself, but I don't think I could do what the extraordinary colleagues in our funeral business do each day, the care and attention that they give to the deceased and the support that they provide to the families is absolutely immense.

00:08:30:16 - 00:08:55:03 - Debbie

They are really extraordinary. I really just want to thank each and every one of them for the role that they play in making our final journey as special as they do. We have invested, as you quite rightly pointed out, because there are real challenges in the funeral industry. The death rate has been down in the post Covid, era.

00:08:55:05 - 00:09:18:23 - Debbie

And also we have been losing market share and we've been losing market share to ostensibly online operators and, people that actually haven't invested in the assets, in the way that we have. But something that was really important to me is the care of the deceased and the dignity that is actually, preserved throughout all of that journey.

00:09:18:23 - 00:09:42:15 - Debbie

So you've been here, today to be able to experience the back of house. So we have put a lot of investment, in there. So there is absolute respect and decency every step of the journey. But in addition to that, we've invested in our care hub, and that has digitalised all of the appropriate checks on the deceased.

00:09:42:15 - 00:09:54:21 - Debbie

And to make sure that we're keeping families up-to-date every step of the way through the journey from when people come into our care until that final, journey.

00:09:54:23 - 00:10:30:18 - Phil

That's great. And I mean, we we've all seen on the news, over, you know, recent times, what happens when, funeral operators don't give that level of care and, you know, frankly, it's quite distressing for families. So it's so important. And I know you know how important that is. Your Society and indeed I, I think I heard your President, Elaine Dean, talking recently about campaigning for regulation in the funeral services to ensure that actually funeral premises are required to be regulated, inspected and know that wouldn't be a problem for your organisation given the standards of care.

00:10:30:18 - 00:10:37:01 - Phil

But it would hopefully ensure that, you know, everyone's brought up to that level of standards. So that's something that you're quite passionate about.

00:10:37:01 - 00:11:00:10 - Debbie

It really is. And as you quite rightly point out, it's our Board, it's our President, and it's all of our colleagues across the Society. So we established a policies and campaigns group, and we're really privileged. We've got Joe Fortune from The Co-op Party. We've got Dame Pauline Green, a legend within the co-operative movement, are on that committee.

00:11:00:10 - 00:11:37:09 - Debbie

And that's to really help us, focus our attention where we can bring about change. And that is something that co-ops have always done. They've been brilliant at organising markets much more effectively. And I was staggered, to find that the funeral industry is not currently regulated. So we are working really closely with Government, with all the appropriate trade bodies in the funeral industry to raise those standards, to ensure that everybody receives that same high standard of dignity, care and respect.

00:11:37:11 - 00:11:59:14 - Phil

And of course, the great thing about that is also that, as you know, the merged society already working in regulated areas were clearly our Early Years Childcare business is regulated by Ofsted. You know, our telecoms business with Ofcom, the Travel business with the Civil Aviation Authority. So I think, you know, calling for regulation is not something we should fear.

00:11:59:14 - 00:12:19:03 - Phil

It's actually something we should really get behind because it does raise the standard. Doesn't sure that across the industry, you know, people are competing on a level playing field because that's a challenge isn’t it. And if you're trying to provide a brilliant service, but you're being undercut by operators that perhaps are not getting that same level of care, it makes it harder in terms of competing.

00:12:19:05 - 00:12:42:00 - Debbie

It does, and it certainly is a competitive market in all of the sectors that you've just clarified there. And of course, we, regulation was introduced in terms of the sales of funeral plans, and our team have just done the most amazing job in pulling all of that together. And that is a really thriving area of our, our business.

00:12:42:00 - 00:13:03:12 - Debbie

So that's giving the same care and attention when you're actually thinking about your own funeral and actually what's going to be appropriate for you, but making sure that we offer the products and services that are right for each and every one of our members, and our clients, that is just so important. So the personalisation is absolutely crucial.

00:13:03:18 - 00:13:21:16 - Debbie

And I couldn't agree more that you should embrace regulation, but also we should have a hand in making sure that a specialist in these markets, that the regulation is really appropriate and is going to deliver what we set out to achieve, which is, you know, great value and brilliant products and services.

00:13:21:18 - 00:13:43:10 - Phil

Yeah. And of course, you've got 185 funeral homes, a crematorium, a stone masonry, a coffin making factory, nine florist shops. So it's a really complex, and integrated operation. But I think even though you have that sort of scale and that's a big operation, having just walked round here, you can see that locally. It's very much a personalised touch.

00:13:43:10 - 01:13:52:21 - Phil

Again, the people feel really that they own they own this operation. It's their operation not being sort of centrally controlled. You can really get a sense of that as you walk around here.

00:13:52:23 - 00:14:18:03 - Debbie

That is so important Phil, because as well as all of those physical assets, we have the most wonderful colleagues and they are the ones that truly make the difference. But having control of your own coffin factory, having control with the standards in your own crematorium, having the wonderful florist means that each and every one of our funeral arrangers can, with confidence, offer those services.

00:14:18:05 - 00:15:02:15 - Debbie

And certainly I remember when my Nanna and when my Dad passed away and they passed away quite closely. Together, you are so overcome with emotion that if you've actually got somebody who's going to help and support you to actually do the flowers and know that they're coming from our florist to know that the coffins will be available and the standards, as you'd expect from our own coffin factory, to know that we've just built a new facility for our stonemason, aspects that you can offer all of that as a one stop shop when people are so busy trying to communicate with friends and family, tell them what's happened, come to terms with their,

00:15:02:17 - 00:15:17:02 - Debbie

own process of grieving and arrange a funeral. And this is how those exceptional colleagues really do have a key point of difference, because they've got all of those businesses right at their fingertips to offer.

00:15:17:04 - 00:15:34:09 - Phil

And you know what's really great as well? Because when I walked in, when signing in, and two colleagues on the front desk and one of them said, it's great to see an old Midcounties face again, I don't what she meant. An old Midcounties face or an old Midcounties face. But either the way, it was great!

00:15:34:09 - 00:15:54:05 - Phil

And I think what's wonderful about proposed merger is, you know, our colleagues back then, you know, left Midcounties to come across to Central Co-op and your travel colleagues left Central Co-op to come across to Midcounties. They're all going to be together again. And that's that's quite special actually, when you think about it, that it'll be part of one organisation, which will be great.

00:15:54:07 - 00:16:30:08 - Debbie

Oh, it really is. And I have to say, the colleagues from Midcounties in the funeral business have been absolutely brilliant. They've really enhanced our products and services. So it's just been brilliant. And the same with Chelmsford. So we've just been welcoming those colleagues across and at Chelmsford, that is something really special, which is actually about bereavement groups. And so they organise in every single one of their funeral homes, groups of people coming together to talk about the different stages of the grieving process and how they can help and support each other.

00:16:30:10 - 00:16:36:22 - Debbie

And that's something we're learning a lot about and actually will be looking to transfer across into all of our funeral homes.

00:16:36:22 - 00:17:00:05 - Phil

Yeah. And, you know, we talked about all these different businesses and in fact, your colleagues that came across in the travel business likewise, you know, really engage, really supportive of everything we've been trying to achieve in travel. And when we look at all these businesses now, I think one of the great questions we've had in, from a colleague is about, will there be opportunities within this new, larger society to move around different businesses?

00:17:00:07 - 00:17:08:09 - Phil

And I know it's something we've done in the past at Midcounties. We've done it. But I imagine your view is that's going to create even more opportunities in the future.

00:17:08:11 - 00:17:51:11 - Debbie

One of the most exciting aspects of the coming together of the two societies are the opportunities for colleagues, and they're going to be immense way beyond what either society can offer at the moment. So everything from debt free degrees, from apprenticeships, etc. and at the moment they probably have been focused within each of the businesses. I have the benefit of being on the Co-operative Group graduate training scheme, and it worked for Marks and Spencer very early on in my career, and I learned the most from actually going across a family of businesses, and I think it just creates much more rounded leaders that actually have a lot more empathy and understanding of how the

00:17:51:11 - 00:18:17:23 - Debbie

other businesses operate. So it means, they have their skills are developed and I think will be a real opportunity and component of the future, bringing all of that together. I think I've mentioned as well, not just the family of businesses and therefore all the different, businesses you can experience and learn from. But it's also the new skills that we're actually going to need.

00:18:18:00 - 00:18:46:22 - Debbie

And I'd certainly like to call out technology. And obviously looking at creating a global digital platform is certainly going to create lots of jobs in the area of technology. And I think neither society has been big enough to really have, the right level of investment in membership, in marketing and communication to the customer. So I think that's going to be another core area of opportunity.

00:18:47:03 - 00:19:02:12 - Debbie

So I think what colleagues should be thinking about is the opportunities that are going to be created as a result of the societies coming together, and to look for those opportunities, and they will become clearer, of course, once we've completed the democratic process.

00:19:02:15 - 00:19:30:06 - Phil

What is really interesting, because, I mean, I joined Midcounties ten years ago and originally came to just run the food business, and within a year I was. So could you pick up, you know, Travel and Funeral and Early Years and other businesses as well and so I, you know, experience that opportunity to expand your knowledge and your interests straight away and, as you know, visiting sites, you often come across people that say, well, I used to work in Food and now I work in Travel and I now work in Early Years.

00:19:30:08 - 00:19:54:18 - Phil

But also the families that work for us. I mean, I, you know, I talk to people, say, oh, my daughter works in our branch at so and so, or my wife works at our branch at so and so, so different businesses. So I think there's lots of opportunities for colleagues working different businesses, but also to encourage family members to join the organisation and perhaps work in different fields then, because perhaps, you know, in the evening when you're sat eating dinner, you don't want to be both talking about the food business.

00:19:54:18 - 00:20:06:10 - Phil

It'd be nice to talk about different businesses, but those are the opportunities, and that's quite unique within a co-operative, I think, but particularly in this proposed, society, because of the number of businesses and the range of opportunities that will exist.

00:20:06:12 - 00:20:44:22 - Debbie

Oh, I couldn't agree more. It was fantastic. For me, meeting Little Pioneers was really extraordinary. And that just shows how we're able to grow co-operators of the future and people that have that shared value set. And you often find there are truly co-operative families and they live and breathe the co-operative values and principles. And of course, at different stages in your career, certain businesses will appeal more than others, but the fact that you can actually have choice, that if you do sort of come to the end of your journey in one particular business, you can still stay within the movement and actually look for opportunities elsewhere.

00:20:44:23 - 00:20:54:22 - Phil

Absolutely. And of course, as we've mentioned before, our colleagues do enjoy discounts off your, funeral products and services, don't they? And they've continued to enjoy those discounts.

00:20:54:24 - 00:21:05:10 - Debbie

They do. So I hope that you like what you see here. And obviously we're off. We offer discounts right across the piece. So including the floral as well as your arrangement.

00:21:05:13 - 00:21:16:15 - Phil

Yeah. And, I understand also that you are promoting our holiday business right now through your food stores by offering, free holidays to your members. Is that correct?

00:21:16:17 - 00:21:41:02 - Debbie

Well, we are so trading is really tough out there. We know the level of competition, the amount of price cutting, etc. so if you shop in a Central Co-op store, you've got a chance of winning £1,000s worth of Co-op Travel vouchers that will kindly be, supplied by Midcounties Co-op. So that's £1,000s worth of vouchers every week throughout November.

00:21:41:02 - 00:22:04:05 - Debbie

So there really is an incentive to drive the footfall. And in addition to that the opposite extreme, we've got some fantastic deals, particularly on bigger packs. So I was just looking through as I'm starting to plan. We host a lot of people over the Christmas period, so we've got 32 toilet rolls for £8. I think that works at about 25p a roll, but it really is important.

00:22:04:05 - 00:22:27:18 - Debbie

And I say to all of you as colleagues, please keep the questions coming. It really does help us shape the future of the two societies coming together but remained focused. Look for every opportunity that you can to surprise and delight all of our members and customers, especially on that key time in the run up towards Christmas and the New Year.

00:22:27:20 - 00:22:41:04 - Phil

Yeah well said. And don't forget if you've missed any of the previous podcasts, you can find them all on the usual platforms. And also there's, an extensive set of, frequently asked questions on those platforms as well, where you’ll get more information.